Unterhaltung mit #deegree

(14:27:49) Das Thema für #deegree ist: Welcome to deegree, an OSGeo project. Visit the main project page at http://deegree.org and our wiki at http://wiki.deegree.org with lots of extra info. Check out a running system at http://demo.deegree.org and follow us on twitter @deegree_org.
(14:30:06) markusschneider: Hi everybody!
(14:30:15) ndrs1: hi all
(14:30:48) markusschneider: Does anybody know if Torsten will grace us with his presence?
(14:30:55) copierrj: hi
(14:31:50) markusschneider: Meeting page: http://wiki.deegree.org/deegreeWiki/TmcMeeting/TmcMeeting20121015
(14:31:58) markusschneider: so, i guess not?
(14:32:05) markusschneider: shall we begin then?
(14:32:10) copierrj: ok
(14:32:24) markusschneider: johannes???????????????????
(14:33:25) markusschneider: lets give him 3 more mins, shall we?
(14:34:25) markusschneider: send him a short message...
(14:35:23) markusschneider: sent
(14:37:15) markusschneider: ok, then it will be the three of us only :-(
(14:37:40) markusschneider: Welcome! Anything remarks regarding the agenda?
(14:38:00) markusschneider: not english good
(14:38:04) copierrj: deegree day?
(14:38:23) markusschneider: in addition to the 3.2 release?
(14:38:40) copierrj: possibly
(14:38:49) markusschneider: ok. noted that
(14:38:54) markusschneider: anything else?
(14:39:26) markusschneider: let's try to go through the list quickly, it's rather long.
(14:39:42) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6321: Migrate issue tracker to JIRA: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6321&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:40:22) markusschneider: Last entry was from torsten after the last TMC meeting...
(14:40:43) ndrs1: what was the status wrt the PSC here?
(14:40:52) ndrs1: maybe we can assign it back to Jens then
(14:41:02) markusschneider: it is assigned to Jens...
(14:41:06) ndrs1: ah, right
(14:41:23) markusschneider: action: ask psc for comment?
(14:41:38) ndrs1: maybe we can ask the PSC for combined comments on all outstanding issues
(14:41:44) markusschneider: +1
(14:41:50) copierrj: +1
(14:42:07) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6320: Migrate artifact repository to Nexus: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6320&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:42:28) ndrs1: I added info in the Wiki and sent an email to the list
(14:42:35) ndrs1: so I suppose Jens can close this issue
(14:43:24) ndrs1: or shall we do that?
(14:43:30) markusschneider: Was not opened by Jens, but by Torsten.
(14:43:37) markusschneider: I guess it would be fine to close it.
(14:43:43) ndrs1: ok, I'll do it
(14:44:06) markusschneider: Thanks.
(14:44:13) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6297: Find a usable definition of "stable" for deegree modules: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6297&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:46:24) markusschneider: Still a tough one.
(14:46:51) markusschneider: And depends on 6298...
(14:47:10) markusschneider: I guess we have to postpone it once more. Any comments?
(14:47:16) ndrs1: ok
(14:47:24) copierrj: +1
(14:47:26) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6298: Prepare a suggestion for maintained components/modules: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6298&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:47:56) markusschneider: Ok. There was progress on the Maven site, right Andreas?
(14:48:17) ndrs1: true. Unfortunately the links deep down in the project tree are still not working...
(14:48:39) ndrs1: I suppose we could also add a custom report checking for your flag in the pom.xml files
(14:48:48) ndrs1: add -> write a mojo
(14:49:29) markusschneider: You mean in order to include the status in the site report?
(14:49:56) ndrs1: http://buildserver.lat-lon.de/hudson/job/deegree-3.2-site/
(14:50:04) ndrs1: yes, exactly
(14:50:49) ndrs1: well, I'd say it's work in progress
(14:51:07) ndrs1: it takes a little time as it's a bit tedious to always wait til the site has been rebuilt
(14:51:10) markusschneider: ok. nice to see that it's moving forward, at least.
(14:51:15) ndrs1: yep
(14:51:31) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6322: Migrate source code to git, possibly using bitbucket: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6322&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:51:52) ndrs1: as commented in the ticket, I've made a couple of tries
(14:51:58) markusschneider: Ok. Quit a few new entries.
(14:52:00) markusschneider: Quite
(14:52:20) ndrs1: summary: two-way bridge is not possible due to our repository history
(14:52:36) ndrs1: so a migration at a specific day needs to be done
(14:52:52) copierrj: is such a two-way bridge required/usefull?
(14:52:57) ndrs1: but we haven't heard back from the PSC whether our answers are sufficient
(14:53:23) ndrs1: copierrj: no, but it would have been nice to just do the step and allow developers an easier migration
(14:53:51) ndrs1: now we definitely need to wait for the PSC to answer us, and we need better preparation
(14:54:30) markusschneider: Right. IMHO, everything has been said on that matter. Let's ask the PSC for comment on this one as well.
(14:54:36) ndrs1: +1
(14:54:41) copierrj: +1
(14:54:54) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6387: Update the deegree 3 roadmap: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6387&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:56:16) markusschneider: Looking at the list: I suggest to discuss what we actually achieved, when it comes to the 3.2 release item?
(14:56:25) ndrs1: ok
(14:56:41) copierrj: ok
(14:56:52) markusschneider: And then: Update roadmap
(14:57:10) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #1275: Propose process for dealing with feature requests in the deegree issue tracker: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1275&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:57:35) markusschneider: Some comments have been made since the last meeting...
(14:58:17) copierrj: still depends on Jira/git decision imho
(14:58:23) ndrs1: yep
(14:58:24) markusschneider: right
(14:58:44) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6389: Version numbering schema used for deegree: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6389&group_id=27&atid=303
(14:59:07) markusschneider: There has been some discussion on the ml.
(14:59:09) markusschneider: as well
(14:59:16) markusschneider: did everybody read it?
(14:59:20) ndrs1: yep
(14:59:34) copierrj: no I didn't
(15:00:06) markusschneider: i believe we all should now, so we can discuss the matter
(15:00:41) markusschneider: not on the ml, sorry
(15:00:43) markusschneider: tmc mail
(15:02:56) markusschneider: I generally agree with the practices proposed by Torsten and Andreas.
(15:03:19) markusschneider: This should be our goal.
(15:03:55) markusschneider: However, it doesn't seem feasible for the 3.x series to me. We already broke the API a lot of times (for good reasons, BTW).
(15:04:11) ndrs1: since this is too late for 3.2 anyway, we can also postpone a decision/change of practice until the release, then switch to 4.0-pre/alpha
(15:04:27) markusschneider: I would suggest to target API stability for 4.x.
(15:04:45) copierrj: maybe we can mark already stable interfaces as such
(15:05:00) copierrj: eg with an annotation
(15:05:34) markusschneider: good idea, but i guess we would need a process for that.
(15:06:07) copierrj: agreed
(15:06:29) copierrj: a typical subsystem maintainer task imho...
(15:06:39) markusschneider: shall we target a process / rules for 4.x?
(15:06:45) ndrs1: markusschneider: +1
(15:06:58) markusschneider: yes, and i would suggest to include a review by TMC members...
(15:07:27) copierrj: +1, +1
(15:07:37) markusschneider: IMHO, with 3.2 we're just at the edge of approaching stability with regards to architecture and module structure...
(15:07:49) markusschneider: And we're on a good way. But not quite there.
(15:08:20) markusschneider: OK. API stability is for 4.x then. What about configuration stability.
(15:08:36) markusschneider: Basically, we had this goal for the 3.x series.
(15:08:43) copierrj: imho more important
(15:08:44) markusschneider: But in some cases, we failed.
(15:08:52) markusschneider: Not too many, though.
(15:09:04) markusschneider: Can we list them?
(15:09:11) markusschneider: SQLFeatureStore
(15:09:29) copierrj: we might need another (technical) solution in some cases
(15:09:37) markusschneider: We had PostGISFeatureStore before...
(15:09:56) markusschneider: And mapping concepts evolved during the 3.x series.
(15:10:00) ndrs1: agreed. A crude migration tool to migrate eg. the old WMS config to the new one already exists
(15:10:13) copierrj: we could introduce 'experimental' features
(15:10:36) copierrj: which might change in future versions
(15:10:59) markusschneider: But then we would need a process again...
(15:11:10) ndrs1: agreed. So also do it for 4.x?
(15:11:14) copierrj: unfortunately yes
(15:11:21) markusschneider: I would suggest: Yes to configuration stability for 3.x.
(15:11:24) markusschneider: But:
(15:12:13) markusschneider: Allow a list of exceptions (which we should of course try to minimize). Ask the PSC if anybody will found converters for incompatible changes.
(15:12:32) markusschneider: I know that this is not too satisfying.
(15:12:38) markusschneider: Any other ideas?
(15:13:28) markusschneider: I suggest to have a clear process starting after the 3.2 releas.
(15:13:33) ndrs1: +1
(15:13:41) copierrj: +1
(15:13:55) markusschneider: action item: define interface stabilility / change process
(15:14:22) markusschneider: i also suggest to discuss this on the mailing list.
(15:14:28) ndrs1: +1
(15:14:34) copierrj: +1
(15:14:40) markusschneider: so people know our difficultires
(15:15:20) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6294: Regular pre-release builds/quality assurance: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6294&group_id=27&atid=303
(15:15:47) markusschneider: Nothing to see here ;-)
(15:15:55) ndrs1: ;-)
(15:16:16) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6392: Missing release artifacts in deegree artifact repository: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6294&group_id=27&atid=303
(15:16:48) markusschneider: (discussion should be shorter than 3.2 release actions)
(15:16:49) ndrs1: TMC tracker item #6392: Missing release artifacts in deegree artifact repository: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6292&group_id=27&atid=303
(15:16:56) markusschneider: sorry, wrong link
(15:17:12) ndrs1: TMC tracker item #6392: Missing release artifacts in deegree artifact repository: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6392&group_id=27&atid=303
(15:17:32) markusschneider: Did you guys follow the problem on the mailing list?
(15:17:37) ndrs1: yes
(15:17:45) copierrj: more or less
(15:17:56) markusschneider: So we lost artifacts again.
(15:18:07) markusschneider: Due to old Artifactory problems.
(15:18:16) ndrs1: and missing backups
(15:18:37) markusschneider: My suggestion: Rebuild 3.0.x and 3.1.x releases
(15:18:47) markusschneider: and deploy to Nexus.
(15:19:40) ndrs1: I can do that
(15:20:28) ndrs1: probably new 3.0 and 3.1 releases are in order
(15:20:34) ndrs1: with modified poms
(15:21:19) markusschneider: Right. Let's built 3.0.5 and 3.1.3 and put them into Nexus. End of (Artifactory) story.
(15:21:34) ndrs1: and update the wiki page/description
(15:21:48) markusschneider: good. action item to the release manager, i guess.
(15:21:58) ndrs1: I can do that
(15:22:11) markusschneider: good. but the release manager should be involved.
(15:22:27) markusschneider: fine by me.
(15:22:28) markusschneider: +1
(15:22:32) ndrs1: yes, he can update the website and stuff
(15:23:10) markusschneider: Reijer?
(15:23:33) copierrj: +1
(15:23:37) markusschneider: thanks
(15:23:39) markusschneider: TMC tracker item #6391: Define actions for deegree 3.2 release: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6294&group_id=27&atid=303
(15:24:03) markusschneider: sorry
(15:24:14) markusschneider: http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6391&group_id=27&atid=303
(15:25:11) markusschneider: Ok.
(15:25:24) markusschneider: Remember: Target date is deegree day.
(15:25:43) markusschneider: 4 weeks.
(15:25:50) markusschneider: not too much time
(15:26:02) markusschneider: - Define quality goals
(15:26:11) ndrs1: unit tests pass, IT tests pass
(15:26:35) ndrs1: using PMD/Checkstyle/Findbugs needs more discussion
(15:26:48) ndrs1: remember my checkstyle mail/Wiki page - no comments as of yet
(15:27:03) markusschneider: well, thanks for you efforts in any case
(15:27:06) markusschneider: good work
(15:27:09) ndrs1: thanks
(15:27:14) markusschneider: well done
(15:27:23) ndrs1: *g*
(15:27:57) markusschneider: one big problem is: "INSPIRE release"
(15:28:03) markusschneider: but no INSPIRE tests...
(15:28:26) ndrs1: and no test data. IIRC idgis wanted to provide some?
(15:28:33) markusschneider: right.
(15:28:39) markusschneider: I suggest to call for help here.
(15:28:50) ndrs1: copierrj: any updates from Herman?
(15:29:01) copierrj: we do have an inspire service online
(15:29:12) copierrj: I'll ask Herman about this
(15:29:17) ndrs1: ok
(15:29:33) markusschneider: ok. and i report to psc / mailing list
(15:30:01) markusschneider: maybe we can get some help
(15:30:15) markusschneider: - Review code
(15:30:26) markusschneider: I don't see that happening for 3.2
(15:30:32) ndrs1: me neither
(15:30:48) markusschneider: - Solve issues
(15:31:07) markusschneider: Roadmap: http://wiki.deegree.org/deegreeWiki/deegree3/Roadmap
(15:31:30) ndrs1: CRS package: I don't see that one happening
(15:31:40) copierrj: too bad...
(15:32:00) ndrs1: we have 4 weeks, and so far nobody was willing to do it
(15:32:09) ndrs1: any volunteers?
(15:32:10) markusschneider: well, i believe the ball was in your court :-)
(15:32:47) ndrs1: not in mine...
(15:32:55) markusschneider: reijer, you want to tackle that one?
(15:33:04) markusschneider: together of course
(15:33:36) markusschneider: wait
(15:33:36) copierrj: I would like to, it's just unlikely to happen in the next weeks
(15:33:46) ndrs1: that was my point...
(15:33:49) markusschneider: right
(15:33:51) markusschneider: agreed
(15:33:58) markusschneider: so we report the problem to psc
(15:34:18) copierrj: +1
(15:35:02) ndrs1: ok. SQLFeatureStore?
(15:35:10) markusschneider: not happening
(15:35:15) ndrs1: ok, gone
(15:35:23) markusschneider: Security?
(15:35:27) ndrs1: not happening
(15:35:32) markusschneider: Layers/Themes
(15:35:49) markusschneider: done
(15:35:54) ndrs1: yep
(15:35:55) markusschneider: Tile
(15:36:04) markusschneider: done
(15:36:05) markusschneider: WFS
(15:36:06) markusschneider: done
(15:36:12) markusschneider: General
(15:36:24) ndrs1: INSPIRE compliance not tested
(15:36:31) markusschneider: will be reported
(15:36:36) ndrs1: deegree-core-base modularisation: started
(15:36:50) copierrj: we've received 'official' test results for our INSPIRE solution
(15:37:09) markusschneider: can we run that for the final release? or a rc?
(15:37:45) copierrj: don't know, I only got the results....
(15:38:28) markusschneider: ok. will note that
(15:38:33) markusschneider: Implement workspace registry
(15:38:36) markusschneider: not usable
(15:38:40) ndrs1: yep
(15:39:14) ndrs1: ok, then we can update the roadmap with that
(15:39:15) markusschneider: Back to http://wald.intevation.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=6391&group_id=27&atid=303
(15:39:40) markusschneider: Review configuration file consistency:
(15:40:01) markusschneider: I suggest to do that for the first RC.
(15:40:15) markusschneider: BTW, I would favor weekly builds from now on.
(15:40:19) ndrs1: +1
(15:40:29) ndrs1: unfortunately, the RM is not here
(15:40:32) copierrj: +1
(15:40:34) markusschneider: +1
(15:40:48) markusschneider: -pre12 -rc1 -rc2 -rc3=final
(15:40:58) ndrs1: +1
(15:41:01) copierrj: +1
(15:41:03) markusschneider: goof
(15:41:05) markusschneider: good
(15:41:14) markusschneider: - Resolve CRS issue
(15:41:20) markusschneider: will be reported
(15:41:28) markusschneider: - INSPIRE tests ("3.2 INSPIRE release")
(15:41:35) markusschneider: we need help and i will report that
(15:41:59) markusschneider: may i suggest to have the next tmc meeting in one week?
(15:42:06) copierrj: +1
(15:42:10) ndrs1: +1
(15:42:17) markusschneider: well
(15:42:24) markusschneider: thanks for your endurance
(15:42:41) ndrs1: hear you in 20 Minutes then
(15:42:49) copierrj: cu
(15:42:51) markusschneider: right!
(15:42:54) markusschneider: bye and thanks